How much should I ask for? (206.0)

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01:16 pm January 5th, 2009

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			How much should I ask for? (206.0) - Mark's Journal

mhaithaca


	How much should I ask for? (206.0)
	Someone contacted me this morning to ask if she could use or purchase rights to this photo I took of the White House, for use in an Obama-themed calendar. I do think it's a great picture, though I don't know how well it will reproduce! She's welcome to try. Apparently, she's an MBA student and was involved in the Obama campaign. I'm guessing it's a class project; she's got a small budget and is doing a 1,000-copy print run. I'm guessing I can't expect much, and I'm tempted to give her a low figure with the proviso that she'll pay more if they do a reprint or if she wants to use it again for 2010, as she suggested she might. Thoughts?

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	Comments

	From: psychochicken	Date: January 5th, 2009 03:26 pm (UTC)		(Link)

The low cost for her initial run with a condition that she'll have to approach you again if she wants to use it again is a good idea. That way you're helping out initially, but sharing in the success if the image works well for her.

Make sure it's all documented in a useage license, stating that copyright remains with you and exactly what she's allowed to do with it under that license agreement (i.e. use it in whatever size for the initial 1000 run of her calendar). Make sure it also says that she has to approach you again for additional usage. Then you both sign it. Simple!

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	From: ruhe	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:54 pm (UTC)		(Link)

I vote for this type of arrangement - and make sure your copyright is document/held/reserved.

If she's selling the calendar, I'd ask for a bigger dollar figure than I otherwise would, but I like the psycho's comment on the licensing arrangement.

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	From: psychochicken	Date: January 5th, 2009 06:57 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Licensing is the norm in illustration, as is retention of copyright. Don't know how photography works but it seems it could work on a similar basis.

To be honest, selling 1000 calendars isn't going to make anyone rich. If she makes a dollar on each calendar, that's less than $100 per month page.... I'd say if you want to support her, do so for a nominal fee - the license will ensure you reap a reward if it's a success.

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From: 5251962	Date: January 5th, 2009 03:43 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Can you ask for royalties on an image? I mean, low figure, plus a cut would be good, wouldn't it? As well as credit, of course.

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	From: psychochicken	Date: January 5th, 2009 06:58 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Oh, absolutely insist on a full credit - and a mention of a website if you have one.

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	From: emaline412	Date: January 5th, 2009 03:48 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Five dollars!

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	From: darth_qonfused	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:00 pm (UTC)		(Link)

I wonder if it's complicated by the CreativeCommons license that Flickr applies to images:

http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.0/deed.en

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	From: blaisepascal	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:19 pm (UTC)		(Link)

She could use it to her hearts content without asking if she were willing to abide by the terms of the license. But she doesn't want to abide by those terms, so she has to ask the copyright owner for other terms.

That's what she's doing. Flickr doesn't own the copyright, they just hold a non-exclusive, royalty free license to host it and serve it to all askers. So she asks MHA.

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	From: kinnerc	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:23 pm (UTC)		(Link)

They put that on by default?

Wow! Weird day. I had a Creative Commons Licensing question come in this morning that I had to deal with.

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	From: darth_qonfused	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:26 pm (UTC)		(Link)

yes, that's their default requirements for them to be able to distribute the image, as Bu pointed out.

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	From: kinnerc	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:33 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Ah. OK, yea. That makes sense. Guess I didn't closely read Bu's post.

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	From: mhaithaca	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:34 pm (UTC)		(Link)

No it's not. I could, and many people do, specify "All rights reserved" instead of providing a Creative Commons license that gives many people permission to use my work without asking, under specific conditions.

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	From: mhaithaca	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:29 pm (UTC)		(Link)

They put that license on by default because it's the license I specified as my default license. My user agreement with Flickr (now Yahoo!) allowing them to display images based on my settings is unrelated.

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	From: mhaithaca	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:31 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Not at all. That's the license I specified for the image... and actually for nearly all of my images, as my default setting. The image is still mine, and while the BY-NC-SA license would let her use the image without asking me, merely by crediting me, in a non-commercial way, it requires her to ask and make arrangements with me before using it in a commercial way.

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	From: kinnerc	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:35 pm (UTC)		(Link)

OK, that makes sense. I remember making that my default license on my photos as well.

We actually had a request come in to release a photo of Dr. Janet Mattei so someone could use it on Wikipedia, but they won't accept BY-NC-SA, only BY or BY-SA, so we'll have to make a case-by-case decision when Arne gets back from HI tomorrow.

I'm going to make a case that by default all of our materials are BY-NC-SA, which I think Arne may go for.

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	From: mhaithaca	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:48 pm (UTC)		(Link)

For an organization like yours, BY-NC-SA makes a lot of sense.

As for Wikipedia, that's a 501(c)(3) non-profit, and would certainly qualify under the BY-NC-SA license. There should be no reason someone posting a photo on Wikipedia should need you to remove the non-commercial portion of the license, but if you want to give them specific permission to use a specific photo in a specific manner on a specific web site, it shouldn't hurt anyone.

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	From: kinnerc	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:22 pm (UTC)		(Link)

"Five million dollars!" :-)

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	From: darth_qonfused	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:28 pm (UTC)		(Link)

100 Billion Dollars?

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	From: fabunobo	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:54 pm (UTC)		(Link)

I am rolling around on the floor under my desk cackling right now!

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	From: fabunobo	Date: January 5th, 2009 04:56 pm (UTC)		(Link)

OMG! Something similar just happened to me! But I gave away my pics for free. I'm not Jewish. Ha ha ha! Was that my inner voice?

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From: dblaser_ca	Date: January 5th, 2009 05:00 pm (UTC)		(Link)

What's the typical amount that a picture like this is licensed for?

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	From: joyfulchaos	Date: January 5th, 2009 05:15 pm (UTC)		(Link)

I don't have any advice on a dollar figure, but I do have thoughts: That's cool!

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	From: brazenredhead	Date: January 6th, 2009 12:01 am (UTC)		(Link)

I agree!!!!

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From: moriarty6	Date: January 6th, 2009 12:07 am (UTC)		(Link)

Probably echoing what others have said, but I'd expect a few hundred bucks for limited reprint rights. Just make sure that you're not giving them unlimited usage rights, and that they'll have to renegotiate if they plan another print run.

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	From: sp_jesse	Date: January 6th, 2009 07:41 pm (UTC)		(Link)

To support her in her efforts as a collegiate, I think I'd ask for a very minimal amount and spell out that it is only for the 1,000 print run (max) and only for 2009.

I'd basically ask for a calendar and enough to be able to make a print and frame the picture to hang in my house somewhere (and maybe enough to send a framed copy to a friend that now lives in Illinois ;))

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